Discuss Spyware Terminator listing

La vie du site, boîte à idées, feedback

Modérateur: Modérateurs et Modératrices

Messagede ADSLgratuit » 11 07 2007

thanks,
witch personnals informations are given to your sponsors ?

....and is it possible to show the sources of the crawler toolbar to Pierre, the administrator of ASSISTE.COM. Perhaps, it will be a solution to reexamine the presence of Spyware terminator in the crapware section....

regards
ADSLgratuit
 
Messages: 36
Inscription: 26 08 2003
Localisation: Paris

Messagede Tokar » 11 07 2007

I do not think the development team would be willing to do that for a two reasons:
1) the program is closed source, it is not open source. So it would go against our license.
2) frankly, we would not trust our sources in the hands of Pierre. This is not meant to single him out...we would not trust our sources in the hands of any independently run website.

There should be enough tools available on the web (for free) which can accurately analyze the full range of abilities of Crawler Toolbar (packet analyzers, resource hackers, bandwidth meters, CPU meters, etc.).



There is no personal information given to our sponsors. No names, no addresses, no age, etc. Everything that we collect is accurately defined in Crawler's Privacy Policy as in line with other major search engines. In short: we don't sell, share or distribute any personal information from our users:

From Crawler Privacy Policy:
http://www.spywareterminator.com/legal/privacy.aspx
Information Collection
Visiting and using Crawler Services may result in Crawler receiving performance and usage information (such as search term, time of day, browser type, default language setting, IP address, an anonymous identifier). This information will not be used to personally identify you.

Sharing of Information
Crawler does not collect any personally identifiable information unless provided by you, and we will not share, rent or sell any of your personally identifiable information provided by you. We may share aggregated non-personally identifiable information with third parties outside of Crawler. Aggregate non-personally identifiable information is recorded about users and collected into groups so that it no longer reflects or references an individually identifiable user. We may disclose some information in response to subpoenas, court orders, or other legal requirements.


From Google Privacy Policy:
http://www.google.com/privacy.html
Google’s servers automatically record information when you visit our website or use some of our products, including the URL, IP address, browser type and language, and the date and time of your request.


From Yahoo! Privacy Policy:
http://info.yahoo.com/privacy/us/yahoo/details.html
Yahoo! automatically receives and records information on our server logs from your browser, including your IP address, Yahoo! cookie information, and the page you request.


From MSN Privacy Policy:
http://mobile.msn.com/device/en-us/privacy.aspx
We may collect information about your visit, including the pages you view, the links you click and other actions taken in connection with Microsoft sites and services. We also collect certain standard information that your browser sends to every website you visit, such as your IP address, browser type and language, access times and referring Web site addresses.
Tokar
 
Messages: 24
Inscription: 02 07 2007

Messagede Sacles » 11 07 2007

Hello,

It is not the problems of some which justify those the others.

Crawler is a problem. This is important and the other things (other companies, Assiste,...) are details which do not justify your position.

Et je résume mon avis en français:

1/ Crawler ne devrait être installée que par une action volontaire de l'utilisateur (cocher une option pour l'installation et pas décocher si on ne veut pas cette installation). C'est un minimum, le mieux serait évidemment de ne pas proposer ce Crawler.

2/ Le fait de dire qu'il y a aussi des problèmes chez d'autres ne constitue en rien une justification. De même dire qu'Assiste devrait aussi les mettre dans sa crapathèque ne justifie rien.

Il y a un problème avec Crawler, c'est l'éditeur de SpywareTerminator qui a en a la responsabilité et lui seul. Le reste, toujours de moins point de vue, c'est de la diversion.

Salut.
Ne confiez jamais entièrement la sécurité de votre PC à vos logiciels
Avatar de l’utilisateur
Sacles
 
Messages: 778
Inscription: 19 09 2004
Localisation: Près de Liège (Belgique francophone)

Messagede Tokar » 11 07 2007

ADSLgratuit a écrit:
Sacles a écrit:Re,

Bad response.
Mauvaise réponse.

De la part de ...?

Salut.


Bonsoir Sacles,

Tokar confirme qu'il ne révèlera pas des informations personnelles collectées sur nos PC. Il confirme par là que la crawler toolbar est au minimum un spyware, et peut-être pire (Trojan ?) vu qu'il ne veut pas détailler les informations personnelles qui sont collectées. D'ailleurs il ne dit pas à qui elles sont envoyées et quelle en est leur utilisation. Il refuse à Assiste.com la possibilité d'examiner les sources (le code) de la toolbar, et demande par contre que nous lui fassions une confiance aveugle quand aux déclarations qu'il a faites, et qui sont invérifiables.

Mauvaise réponse de Tokar.




How did I confirm spyware or trojans? Please tell me.



I would like you to ask Google or Yahoo! to share the sources of their toolbar with Pierre. I would love to hear their responses to your request.



I thought I made clear that we dont collect personal information. I thought our PRIVACY POLICY made that clear. You did not read this correctly.

Crawler does not collect any personally identifiable information unless provided by you and we will not share, rent or sell any of your personally identifiable information provided by you
---Straight out of Crawler privacy policy.


My statements are not what you should be basing your statements off of. You should be basing your statements from our privacy policy, which are legally binding and have been provided and I have linked for your convenience. Your response shows that you have NOT read our privacy policy in full, nor does it show that you have read OTHER Search Engine privacy policies in full.

I suggest you take the time to do so.
Tokar
 
Messages: 24
Inscription: 02 07 2007

Messagede ADSLgratuit » 11 07 2007

Ce n'est pas vérifiable.
ADSLgratuit
 
Messages: 36
Inscription: 26 08 2003
Localisation: Paris

Messagede Tokar » 12 07 2007

Yes.

Before I began working for Crawler/Spyware Terminator, I never gave the company any of my personal information (to start with Crawler my personal information was required to put me on the payroll :D).

I am confident in the truth of the statements of the privacy policy and our other policies.


I know that we have a legal team willing to defend our policies if need be, and I know our policies have been written with legal help to provide truthful information which counter the claims made by Assiste.com.free.fr and similar websites.


I think you should invest some time in reading Google, Yahoo, MSN, AOL, etc. policies. You will see that they are all the same in their intents. What are you comments on the quotes from the policies of Google, Yahoo and MSN above? They are no different than Crawler's yet you are criticizing Crawler and not those search engines.
Tokar
 
Messages: 24
Inscription: 02 07 2007

Messagede césar » 13 07 2007

Tokar a écrit:What are you comments on the quotes from the policies of Google, Yahoo and MSN above? They are no different than Crawler's yet you are criticizing Crawler and not those search engines.


Actually, that's not true.
Every toolbars and instant messenger stuff are considered unsafe, for many reasons.
You can read it here :
- http://assiste.com.free.fr/p/abc/a/barr ... olbar.html
- http://assiste.com.free.fr/p/abc/a/mess ... rivee.html

And for google, just have a look on the forum to see what Peter (I'm thinking in english, now*) think about their privacy policy.

*But I can't speak nor write in it. :Mouaaarrrrffffffff:
césar
 
Messages: 2467
Inscription: 21 12 2003

Messagede Tokar » 13 07 2007

césar a écrit:
Tokar a écrit:What are you comments on the quotes from the policies of Google, Yahoo and MSN above? They are no different than Crawler's yet you are criticizing Crawler and not those search engines.


Actually, that's not true.
Every toolbars and instant messenger stuff are considered unsafe, for many reasons.
You can read it here :
- http://assiste.com.free.fr/p/abc/a/barr ... olbar.html
- http://assiste.com.free.fr/p/abc/a/mess ... rivee.html

And for google, just have a look on the forum to see what Peter (I'm thinking in english, now*) think about their privacy policy.

*But I can't speak nor write in it. :Mouaaarrrrffffffff:


I have read those pages with the best of my ability (i.e. using Google Translate). All that I can determine is that everything is opinion based. Everything on that page are a bunch of claims without proof. I am now speaking in defense of all toolbars known to be safe.

Yes, there are bad toolbars - MySearchToolbar, Bar888, etc. Those obviously have been proven by security professionals to be bad.

But Google? Yahoo!? Ask.com? These are known safe companies.
Pierre provides no proof that these "safe" toolbars do anything listed on that page.

Yes toolbars make use of the BHO ability of IE. However toolbars designed for FF use the XPI plugin ability and no one complains about that.


Look, I'm not going to get into a big discussion about toolbars and their safety just because I wish to discuss the Spyware Terminator Craptheque page, which I am patiently waiting Pierre to address.

There are 9 claims posted on the Craptheque page and they are as follows:

Claim #1) Crawler offers a lot of free software of the trojan kind.
Claim #2) No software is free, there must be revenue somwhere - stealing private info, spyware, adware.
Claim #3) The toolbar BHO is given a negative connotation.
Claim #4) The toolbar installs by means of drive-by ActiveX download.
Claim #5) Crawler and ST are on the dark side of the net and always have been.
Claim #6) Spyware Terminator is sending information.
Claim #7) Spyware Terminator removes competitor products.
Claim #8) Spyware Terminator removes spyware and adware competitors, thus alluding to a claim that Spyware Terminator itself is spyware/adware.
Claim #9) All of our software is using Trojans.


Claim #1) This is not true. If Pierre believe this, then he would need to provide proof in the form of detection logs from other security products, which is not provided.
Claim #2) Free = you do not pay money for use. We do not charge for Spyware Terminator, you pay no money, thus it is free. Yes we have corporate licensing, but you, me, Pierre, etc. as home users, are free to use Spyware Terminator. There are no dark business deals going on. We make our money similar to Google in a search engine based revenue model.
Claim #3) The BHO is not bad. You may scan them with any program you like, you will not find a single problem. Our BHO items are necessary to operate Crawler Toolbar, just like Google BHO's are required to operate Google Toolbar.
Claim #4) This is not true, at all. Again, if Pierre believes this, then he would need to provide proof in the form of videos or screenshots of this process.
Claim #5) By "dark side" I assume Pierre means an area of the net where spyware, adware, and malware are rampant, and proliferate. Crawler and Spyware Terminator are not in the adware, spyware, malware business, and you know this from the WebSearch press release which is in the Craptheque page. Distribution of WebSearch toolbar and HuntBar have LONG since been ceased.
Claim #6) Spyware Terminator sends limited information, all of which is similar to every one of your favorite products (SpyBot, SpySweeper, Windows Defender, Spyware Blaster, etc.). Similar to all of your favorite products, the information is controlled in the program settings. This information is: version information for updates, error reports, and scan reports. No private information is sent unless the user opts to fill in his/her e-mail address.
Claim #7) Another false claim. Please provide proof if you do not believe this.
Claim #8) Spyware Terminator is not adware nor is it spyware. Again, please provide proof if you do not believe this.
Claim #9) None of the Crawler software uses trojans. Again, please provide proof if you do not believe this.


I am waiting patiently for Pierre to respond to the our company responses to his claims.
Tokar
 
Messages: 24
Inscription: 02 07 2007

Messagede Tokar » 16 07 2007

"In order to provide correct, accurate and up to date information, I encourage the editor of this product or service to contact me if any part of this card is to be revised."
Tokar
 
Messages: 24
Inscription: 02 07 2007

Messagede pierre » 16 07 2007

Image
Bonjour,
Devant le différent qui m'oppose personnellement à Tokar sur le jugement que je porte sur Spyware Terminator, et qui pourrait mettre en cause le site même d'Assiste.com, je demande expressément que plus personne n'intervienne dans ce topic sans m'en avoir parlé au préalable. Le sujet est trop sérieux pour être traité de façon superficielle ou à coup de réactions épidermiques même par d'anciens membres aussi compétents et respectables soient ils. Si cela n’est pas respecté je verrouille le fil de discussion jusqu’à ce que je dégage le temps pour ré-analyser l’ensemble des pièces et du produit.

Image
Hello
Facing the different that opposes me, personally, to Tokar on the judgement that I carry on Spyware Terminator, and which could blame even the website Assiste.com, I ask expressly that nobody any more intervene in this topic without having speak preliminary about it with me. The subject is too serious to be covered superficially or with epidermic reactions even by former members, such qualified and sizeable they are. If that is not respected, I lock the thread until I find enough time to analyse once more the whole parts and the product.
Avatar de l’utilisateur
pierre
 
Messages: 23630
Inscription: 20 05 2002
Localisation: Ici et maintenant

PrécédenteSuivante

Retourner vers Mises à jour du site

Qui est en ligne

Utilisateurs parcourant ce forum: Aucun utilisateur enregistré et 2 invités